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 The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon

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Reiko
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PostSubject: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime16th July 2011, 2:29 am

This began as a reply to a post Venus made in the PGSM Personalities thread. I realized the subject had potential and wanted to explore it in a thread.

@Sailor Venus wrote:
It was a pretty bold move trying to make something like Sailor Moon into a live action show. The transformation sequences were just god awful, but how they had the girls' hair change colors and styles made more sense for disguise purposes, rather in the anime they were like PAINFULLY OBVIOUS. Even Naoko added flare and masks in the manga so that the enemy wouldn't INSTANTLY recognize them in public.

In regards to making a live-action Sailor Moon show, "bold" is just a four letter word in Japan. But even if it wasn't, I think people are just stunned at the idea of a live-action Sailor Moon because of the tacky--yet admittedly entertaining--effort of PGSM.

Some points to consider:

Sadly, Japanese film tends not to be as well-executed as Western film. I promise I'm not biased. Stories are universal so lets ignore the big elephant in the room of a girl who magically transforms into a warrior using a brooch--it doesn't depend on the story because the story is constant, it's how the story is told. Film provides an opportunity to narrate with techniques such as editing and cinematography. The Western world owns at those techniques but Japanese film tends to be too static for my liking. And whenever the show tried to make things more dynamic, we ended up with caricatures of the characters. I'll touch more upon this in a bit.

Also, while television is the best medium for storytelling, it has the lowest budget. PGSM had a shoestring budget. Horrible SFX and continuity edits can tell us that much. Example, the random helicopter sounds that can be heard reveals the studio couldn't reshoot due to a time constraint. Time constraints can often correlate with budget. The more you pay the longer you stay. Likewise with how the girls are fighting then, suddenly, its nighttime. While I would love another live-action Sailor Moon adaptation on television purely because of character development opportunities, if we want a kick-butt adaptation, it's more realistic for us to look towards the big screen.

Lastly, realism. One of the most endearing, albeit completely SILLY, aspects of Sailor Moon was how the characters could be so one-dimensional. Now, they weren't always that way, but the TV show still tried insanely hard to mimic the cartoon-y feel of the anime with odd angles and too quirky characters. I loved it in this version, but for a version that can please audiences who are not Sailor Moon fans, realism is the key.

Think of what DC and Marvel are doing with their Superhero films. To me, a guy fighting crime in spandex is just as gaudy as a girl fighting crime in a school girl outfit. Yet, studios have managed to make this work through subtle changes that are still faithful to the design. Costumes are not the only aspect though. The villains are real and sympathetic. PGSM did a great job with the villains, but lost points for all the tokusatsu goons taking up screentime episode after episode. I wouldn't even mind if they didn't look so ridiculous.

Ask for a big elephant I will acknowledge: transformations.

I'm okay with transformations, so long as we don't see them every time. Maybe once as an establishing sort of thing, but otherwise check out the transformation at 7:07 in this vid.



Yeah, that would totally work for me.

Those are my thoughts for now. I'm interested in hearing everyone else's ideas.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime16th July 2011, 9:46 pm

Technology-wise, I think that it could be an incredibly awesome live action show/movie. I have no doubt that the transformation scenes would be riveting and the attacks just as intense as in the manga.

However, I think Hollywood has a fabulous record of ruining a lot of storylines. A series about a bunch of girls is just begging to become Gossip Girls With Super Powers and that would make me vomit in my mouth. I have very little faith in Hollywood's respect for the original love and innocence portrayed in the manga. I doubt the love between Usagi and Mamoru could be accurately conveyed, nor the friendships and the bonds between Usagi and the girls. Moreover, the notion of two lesbians can easily become an excuse for cheap sex shots and innuendos.

I would love for this to be made into a live action show but I shudder at the thought of it being done.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime16th July 2011, 10:07 pm

So this brings to mind the Dragon Ball live action movie that was made in the US within the last few years. Well. It was horrible. Very very bad.

Ironic thing is...it was rather well accepted in japan. A lot of people saw it as an AU telling of the DB story. I think the Japanese for some reason just don't seem to mind bad film.

This is a tad bit going off topic here, but not all Japanese film and tv series are bad. Has anyone watched any of the fairly recent giant monster type movies? Those are AMAZING. They even still use the giant puppets for the Godzilla ones! And its not even that cheesy. And the acting is awesome too. And these are the types of movies known for their cheesiness. I think if Sailor Moon were made into a live action feature length movie in Japan. It would have potential to be something good. It just depends on budget and everything. I think the problem is that there was the rift between Toei and Naoko. PGSM is very seperate from Toei. I know Sailor Moon can bring in the money...and I think Toei would have the budget to support something big too, but i don't know if it will ever happen.

I think the live action PGSM had a lot of Naoko's input into it and I think it was kind of her "baby".

Ok you know i forgot where i was going with this so i'm just going to quit.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime17th July 2011, 10:33 am

@Sailor Jupiter wrote:
Technology-wise, I think that it could be an incredibly awesome live action show/movie. I have no doubt that the transformation scenes would be riveting and the attacks just as intense as in the manga.

However, I think Hollywood has a fabulous record of ruining a lot of storylines. A series about a bunch of girls is just begging to become Gossip Girls With Super Powers and that would make me vomit in my mouth. I have very little faith in Hollywood's respect for the original love and innocence portrayed in the manga. I doubt the love between Usagi and Mamoru could be accurately conveyed, nor the friendships and the bonds between Usagi and the girls. Moreover, the notion of two lesbians can easily become an excuse for cheap sex shots and innuendos.

I would love for this to be made into a live action show but I shudder at the thought of it being done.

I can definitely see what you mean. If it doesn't become Gossip Girls it could end up like Dragon Ball Evolution (barf). But still, look at other successful TV shows like Smallville (my personal fave btw), Heroes, Supernatural, etc. Ask for the movies, Hollywood has been doing a great job with live-action lately. The horrific DB Evolution does make me question character treatment (because that was the worst part IMO) but then I just think of the X-Men films and Nolan's Batman Trilogy. It can be handled beautifully. It depends on the studio and the director, really.

For instance, Avatar (Airbender) had so much potential. But, as soon as M. Night picked it up, it was condemned to be absolute shit. And it was!

But since we're talking of directors... and I should probably post this in the SM Confession thread... but I'm studying film and I want to direct and screenwrite for television and big-screen productions. I have absolute faith that Sailor Moon will be adapted again within our life times. It is my dream to work on that (if not organize it) when the time comes.

@Brit-chan wrote:
So this brings to mind the Dragon Ball live action movie that was made in the US within the last few years. Well. It was horrible. Very very bad.

Ironic thing is...it was rather well accepted in japan. A lot of people saw it as an AU telling of the DB story. I think the Japanese for some reason just don't seem to mind bad film.

This is a tad bit going off topic here, but not all Japanese film and tv series are bad. Has anyone watched any of the fairly recent giant monster type movies? Those are AMAZING. They even still use the giant puppets for the Godzilla ones! And its not even that cheesy. And the acting is awesome too. And these are the types of movies known for their cheesiness. I think if Sailor Moon were made into a live action feature length movie in Japan. It would have potential to be something good. It just depends on budget and everything. I think the problem is that there was the rift between Toei and Naoko. PGSM is very seperate from Toei. I know Sailor Moon can bring in the money...and I think Toei would have the budget to support something big too, but i don't know if it will ever happen.

The thing about DBE is it couldn't decide if it wanted to be DB or DBZ. I know they wanted to emphasize DB for Goku's story but they set it up so they could do that in one movie. It was as if they wanted him to be child Goku in this movie then BAMF adult Goku in the next. That's wayyyy too much to condense. Even though it's hard to do, I can understand one arc per movie. They tried to do an entire series in one movie.

And yeah... the Japanese are so culturally driven they kind of accept film of all caliber if it has enough shock factor and idol support (let's not forget Ayumi Hamasaki was featured on the soundtrack).

I haven't seen any of the Japanese movies recently. But I do know the Japanese are very accepting of the toksatsu genre and that kind of treatment does not fly with national audiences. If Sailor Moon is adapted like PGSM again I wont even bother to watch. Also, Japanese cinematography is just too bland. They don't use enough color correction and alternate filming techniques to genuinely create a visual context. Again, Avatar and DBE sucked but they looked great; I'll give the crews that.

I truly think SM has to be adapted by an American production crew to excel. I'm not saying foreign film isn't worth watching, but America pretty much has the monopoly on film.

What should happen is a representative from each effort. If a production team would consult Naoko-sensei & Toei Animation, this could work.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime17th July 2011, 1:46 pm

@Reiko wrote:
And yeah... the Japanese are so culturally driven they kind of accept film of all caliber if it has enough shock factor and idol support (let's not forget Ayumi Hamasaki was featured on the soundtrack).

I haven't seen any of the Japanese movies recently. But I do know the Japanese are very accepting of the toksatsu genre and that kind of treatment does not fly with national audiences. If Sailor Moon is adapted like PGSM again I wont even bother to watch. Also, Japanese cinematography is just too bland. They don't use enough color correction and alternate filming techniques to genuinely create a visual context. Again, Avatar and DBE sucked but they looked great; I'll give the crews that.

I truly think SM has to be adapted by an American production crew to excel. I'm not saying foreign film isn't worth watching, but America pretty much has the monopoly on film.

What should happen is a representative from each effort. If a production team would consult Naoko-sensei & Toei Animation, this could work.

I think you are right in saying that it might have to take a non-Japanese production to pull it off correctly. I would love to see it done with the special effects that we are capable of doing. As long as it has a budget and the appeal. I just think the problem will be that they will try to condense the plot too much and ruin the characters. :/ But thats just me.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime17th July 2011, 5:12 pm

Ok, now that transformation wasn't bad, but they still could have done something better [I think, at least. I mean, we have some pretty bamf CGA technology out there.] However this one wasn't acceptable at all, and it made me cringe.



I mean, I know SM is tan and all, and that she has blonde/white/pink hair, but that looked like she was a ganguro, or like the Monkey King. And the fake lipstick looks like a child's toy. I don't even.

Yeah. So I think trying to make a live action one is bold, as in, it'd be very hard to pull off correctly. Japan just likes being angst-y and emo, so they made poor Minako terminally ill and Rei seem like she was an escaped convict.

Idk, although I liked PGSM, I feel that someone could do a better job, or that they could have done a better job. We have the technology now, but it is better than Saban Moon [dear god in heaven with piles of kittens, that stuff is so hilariously bad. why america, WHYYYY?]

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 1:13 am

You know for some reason...I enjoyed the the transformations. They aren't the best things in the world, but I still like them. I think what I don't like is how they don't shout their lines loud like they do in the anime. It lacks an omph.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 3:06 pm

@Sailor Venus wrote:
Ok, now that transformation wasn't bad, but they still could have done something better [I think, at least. I mean, we have some pretty bamf CGA technology out there.] However this one wasn't acceptable at all, and it made me cringe.



I mean, I know SM is tan and all, and that she has blonde/white/pink hair, but that looked like she was a ganguro, or like the Monkey King. And the fake lipstick looks like a child's toy. I don't even.

Yeah. So I think trying to make a live action one is bold, as in, it'd be very hard to pull off correctly. Japan just likes being angst-y and emo, so they made poor Minako terminally ill and Rei seem like she was an escaped convict.

Idk, although I liked PGSM, I feel that someone could do a better job, or that they could have done a better job. We have the technology now, but it is better than Saban Moon [dear god in heaven with piles of kittens, that stuff is so hilariously bad. why america, WHYYYY?]

Oh gosh... I couldn't bear to watch Sailor Moon transform the first 5-10 eps of watching PGSM...

Though...I'm actually quite partial to Venus' transformation.



It is very strange to see in a way because her transformation and obviously much more glamorized than the other senshi. It's also a lot more similar to her anime counterpart. Instead of being spun around on a platform in front of a green screen, they make her twirl through the air. Also, I love watching the little dancers skip through her hair.

Speaking of the anime transformations, I think they could work live action. The way the camera spins around them (as opposed to having them spin in front of the camera) and zooms in/out at certain times is very fun to watch. In PGSM they had a stationary camera film almost their whole bodies and that was just awkward to watch.

I know PGSM Rei was a hard-ass... but how did she seem like an escaped convict? Lol, that's probably the most hilarious thing I've heard all day!

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime28th July 2011, 3:31 pm

Here's the main issue which I believe would need to be addressed in order to broaden the appeal of a live-action Sailor Moon: the aesthetics should not interfere with the storytelling. In PGSM, it seems the primary complaint is that it looked as if (and it probably was the case) the show was produced on a meager budget. So they cut a bunch of corners and, as a result, we're left with the aforementioned cheesy transformation sequences and poorly choreographed fight scenes which move from campy to cringe worthy. Underneath all that layer of crap then resides a salvageable story (though I don't care much for some of the alterations undertaken in PGSM) with a very simple yet charming premise: an unassuming teenage school girl is suddenly thrust into this task of effectively protecting and saving the world. I'm not talking about Usagi Tsukino running around with an assault rife stopping Nazi sorcery or rolling through the streets of Tokyo in her Tumbler; she needs to use magic and, really, the friendship she fosters with the other Senshi. At the same time, she wants to remain an ordinary girl. You've got your essential "balancing personal life with duty" theme right there in a nutshell.

I should not be lamenting the aesthetics, just the same way I shouldn't have to bemoan a story in spite of its imaginative setting (I am looking at you, Avatar). An audience is drawn to both characters they can relate to and the fantastical setting into which they are placed. If you get right down to it, I would say it's the basic idea of imagining yourself into the shoes of the characters involved. It's a "realistic" form of escape.

As an example, Iron Man excelled because we were treated to a well written story, fleshed out characters, and superbly done special effects. The whole structure required all of its parts working in tandem. It helped too that Robert Downey, Jr. absolutely nailed the main character Tony Stark and conveyed simultaneously a heroic figure (billionaire genius who builds his own power suits to protect people) anda pathetic person (narcissistic womanizer living on borrowed time). His character is one with which we can relate, even though he exists in a setting which allows for Repulsor Rays and Arc Reactors. The bottom line, to paraphrase President George H.W. Bush, is that we care, and so there is investment in the story as a whole.

We kind of got that in PGSM, with Minako suffering from a terminal disease and being chained to her duty from a young age. But it was laid on in a terribly thick fashion, and thus too much concentration falls upon the trope of her living on borrowed time rather than getting a sense of what drives Minako. Having to leapfrog over the trope to get to her character is, in my view, a sign of poor writing.

Let's return momentarily to the aesthetics, especially since it's so important in Sailor Moon. Both the manga and anime make appearance critical to the magnetism of the series. Otherwise, the Sailor Senshi wouldn't wear such flamboyant outfits and their enemies would generic, evil, monochrome monsters. Yet Takeuchi clearly did not stop at making the Senshi attractive and visually appealing: she gave them lives and relationships; hardships that even a nonmagical person could encounter. The Sailor Senshi effectively become demi-gods, wielding enough power to blunt pure evil yet still struggling with their high school entrance exams. And, as Reiko indicated, DC and Marvel picked up on that aspect (at least more recently---Batman and Robin and Spider-Man 3 notwithstanding) and emphasized it heavily. I would argue that's why all these Marvel tie in films are truly successful.

If I'm going to watch Sailor Moon in a live-action medium, I am going to expect some camp. It's practically a given. In fact, if a Sailor Moon story lacked camp, it would be going about things entirely the wrong way. But I want the story and the setting to take themselves seriously rather than emerge as seemingly half-baked products. I suppose the bottom line is that if a live-action movie were to be made, it should be a full fledged effort rather than a low budget affair.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime17th October 2011, 5:32 pm

I disagree, PGSM wasn't at all a bold move. Sera Myu had been out since 1993, since the Sailor Moon R anime series. Sera Myu had an intensely massive fanbase. And their costumes and special effects are even worse than PGSM X3 (even if i secretly love them). Just look at Yuri Nishina's "Yami koso Utsukushii" original tinsel-Beryl costume and Anza's first Cutie Moon Rod. :3

I find that PGSM is amazing once you get past the special effects. Its really such a little thing in the end, PGSM is more about coping with being a Sailor Senshi. The vast majority of the anime (aside from a few end-of-arc episodes) falls flat on its face in storytelling in comparison. It's sometimes almost like the writers go shopping and said, OH! TENNIS! LETS MAKE AN EPISODE AAAALLL ABOUT TENNIS! As opposed to PGSM where its more like "how would Ami cope if her mother didn't want her going to their school anymore". Not that the anime is bad or anything :3

PGSM wasn't supposed to be a big wowing special effects television show, its really a giant advertisement to sell toys to kids Wink

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime17th October 2011, 5:44 pm

I agree with LilithOfDarkness, the effects and fighting were bad but what kept me going was the storyline.
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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime17th October 2011, 11:21 pm

Am i the only one that doesn't mind the transformations and some of the special effects? I didn't like the CG stuff for the monster of the day...but i srsly did like the transformations and some of the attacks.

I think another thing that bothers me about PGSM versus anime and even Sera Myu, is that when they yell their transformation lines and attack lines in PGSM, they aren't really yelling them...i don't feel a sense of urgency or power like in the anime and i find Sera Myu is even good when it comes to that with some of the acting. That's one thing I don't understand is how quiet everyone is for that sort of stuff. Or even if they are yelling it, it still sounds like they are just talking normally, just projecting a bit more. :/

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th October 2011, 7:27 am

At first, I felt that it reminded me too much of the Power Rangers... Then I got over it and loved every minute of it! I really like some of Minako's songs, too. Memorizing C'est la Vie would be so much easier if I knew Japanese *sigh*

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th October 2011, 8:08 am

I do believe that the making of PGSM was a bold move, just like the musicals. Instead of musicals though, it really did appear that the director wanted to make a tokusatsu of the popular magical girl anime into a form of Karmen Rider/Sentai. Unfortuantely though, PGSM feel short in my standards because it was trying to be too much like the known tokusatsu shows like Karmen Rider/Sentai instead of trying to be established on its own and the graphics really were not that great.

If you think about the CG, the idea was there but the execution was not. Honestly, it felt like someone just told the actresses to do this pose and the pose and that's it. With the exception of Minako's transformation (who had the most movement), the choregraphy for the transformations, attacks, and even the regular battle scene showed poor choregraphy and even if I dare, a lack of creativity. This is a magical girl series and not a Karmen Rider series - they're suppose to really do more than two poses/movements.

Minus my other issues with PGSM, I really felt that the choregraphy execution fell far from what could have been a really great series. I think that even if the cg wasn't all that great, if there was well exceuted choregraphy it would have made up for so much.

I would think that with a tokusatsu show that some of the important features other than the story itself would have been the choregraphy because so much revolves around the fight scenes to progress in the storyline. I mean you see it in the Karmen Rider Series (Some of my favorites in that is Faiz, W, and OOO), you see it in the Sentai series, and even a series calle GARO, which had excellent graphics and awesome choregraphy.

So I often think to myself, why did PGSM fall so short in this category? Budget? Time? I don't know but now I think I'm just rambling ^^;

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th October 2011, 12:27 pm

LilithOfDarkness wrote:
I disagree, PGSM wasn't at all a bold move.

PGSM wasn't supposed to be a big wowing special effects television show, its really a giant advertisement to sell toys to kids Wink

PGSM was an attempt to revive Sailor Moon in Japan nearly 10 years after the anime was broadcasted. I would call this quite bold.

And I'm not blatantly hating on PGSM. I'm a huge fan. The point of this topic was "how to approach a live-action Sailor Moon adaptation" to which PGSM kind of held a precedent. This is a discussion on how to embellish this effort.

@Brit-chan wrote:
Am i the only one that doesn't mind the transformations and some of the special effects?

I think another thing that bothers me about PGSM versus anime and even Sera Myu, is that when they yell their transformation lines and attack lines in PGSM, they aren't really yelling them...i don't feel a sense of urgency or power like in the anime and i find Sera Myu is even good when it comes to that with some of the acting. That's one thing I don't understand is how quiet everyone is for that sort of stuff. Or even if they are yelling it, it still sounds like they are just talking normally, just projecting a bit more. :/

Possibly... LOL. Like I said in one of my earlier posts, it's the stationary camera that kills me. It's not dynamic at all. I love how in the anime it dramatically zooms in to show their eyes then zooms out while rotating.

And I think it was kind of a contextual thing. I know this is the show that brought us a monster made of balloons that shouted "Boingo" but, still, there are things you can get away with in anime and gaudy musicals alone. I dunno, I was happy with MOST of the transformation lines. For the ones I found lackluster... well, that's an issue with the particular actresses because I was always disappointed with their performance.

@Paprika wrote:

If you think about the CG, the idea was there but the execution was not. Honestly, it felt like someone just told the actresses to do this pose and the pose and that's it. With the exception of Minako's transformation (who had the most movement), the choregraphy for the transformations, attacks, and even the regular battle scene showed poor choregraphy and even if I dare, a lack of creativity. This is a magical girl series and not a Karmen Rider series - they're suppose to really do more than two poses/movements.

Minus my other issues with PGSM, I really felt that the choregraphy execution fell far from what could have been a really great series. I think that even if the cg wasn't all that great, if there was well exceuted choregraphy it would have made up for so much.

So I often think to myself, why did PGSM fall so short in this category? Budget? Time? I don't know but now I think I'm just rambling ^^;

^THAT. A hundred times, that. I cringe every time Moon and Mercury put on their boots.

Budget and time are pretty much interrelated. The combined constraints detracted from the overall effectiveness of the show as a live-action Sailor Moon adaptation. You're right, as a show of the Magical Girl genre, it should have glamorized everything much more. We got the girls but not a lot of magic--just cartwheels.

But, back on topic... remember the point of this topic isn't to harp all over PGSM. It's how to approach a LA SM adaptation. What would work? What wouldn't work?



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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th October 2011, 1:10 pm

I think in order to do an LA type Hollywood adaption, it would need to have a really decent budget so we could get proper special fx, an animated talking cat that looks realistic (think along the levels of like Gollum from LOTR or Dobby from Harry Potter). Unfortunately, as popular as Sailor Moon is, I don't think there is enough appeal or perhaps fanbase in the US (not yet at least, it seems like its picking up steam) to have a hollywood company want to shell out millions of dollars for a project that might possibly flop like many other kids oriented movies.

Also, I think if made by a US company, it might be weird to try to set it in Japan. I think it'd be more interesting if they adapted to a more worldly view. It would have to take place in a big city like Tokyo, but maybe all the girls come from different ethnic background?

Sometimes I think it might work better as a Mini-Series like the Dune series got. There is just so much to condense into a movie. Even if trying to condense one season into one movie, i'd hate for it to have too fast of a pacing, kind of like how the beginning of hte manga feels at times, but not as slow of a pacing as the anime series. It might not even be horri-bad if it was a Scy-Fy production. Their production of the Dune series was actually well done. I also enjoyed Tin Man, which was a Scy-Fy production too. A mini-series could work out great too because it could be like 3 or 4 hour long episodes of each arc. So 3-4 Episodes Dark Kingdom, Black Moon, Infinity, Dream, Stars. I think they could also choose to follow the manga a little more closely for pacing and story telling, but maybe leave in elements of the anime too.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th October 2011, 1:31 pm

@Brit-chan wrote:
I think in order to do an LA type Hollywood adaption, it would need to have a really decent budget so we could get proper special fx, an animated talking cat that looks realistic (think along the levels of like Gollum from LOTR or Dobby from Harry Potter). Unfortunately, as popular as Sailor Moon is, I don't think there is enough appeal or perhaps fanbase in the US (not yet at least, it seems like its picking up steam) to have a hollywood company want to shell out millions of dollars for a project that might possibly flop like many other kids oriented movies.

Also, I think if made by a US company, it might be weird to try to set it in Japan. I think it'd be more interesting if they adapted to a more worldly view. It would have to take place in a big city like Tokyo, but maybe all the girls come from different ethnic background?

Sometimes I think it might work better as a Mini-Series like the Dune series got. There is just so much to condense into a movie. Even if trying to condense one season into one movie, i'd hate for it to have too fast of a pacing, kind of like how the beginning of hte manga feels at times, but not as slow of a pacing as the anime series. It might not even be horri-bad if it was a Scy-Fy production. Their production of the Dune series was actually well done. I also enjoyed Tin Man, which was a Scy-Fy production too. A mini-series could work out great too because it could be like 3 or 4 hour long episodes of each arc. So 3-4 Episodes Dark Kingdom, Black Moon, Infinity, Dream, Stars. I think they could also choose to follow the manga a little more closely for pacing and story telling, but maybe leave in elements of the anime too.



My thougths exactly ^^

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th October 2011, 1:41 pm

Oh and something else i thought of. It might end up being done like a lot of comic book super hero movies. I think if it got a budget like that, it'd be interesting, but they might end up making it too american super heroey.

However, they did do a pretty good job on adapting the Scott Pilgrim movie to film. At least I thought so. I didn't get to finish reading the series though. I could see Sailor Moon working more as a live-action American super hero based movie since those are SO popular these days. I mean, who would have thought characters like Thor or Green Lantern would have gotten their own movies. Its obvious for big characters like Batman, Superman, Spiderman, etc. But the smaller heroes, it shows there is an obvious underground appeal for that. Hopefully there is a appeal for Sailor Moon like there is for comic movies, then I think a movie could come to fruition.

ok i'm done. XD

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime18th October 2011, 10:41 pm

I'm not sure if I want to see Americans as the Sailor Senshi >..>

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 12:17 am

LilithOfDarkness wrote:
I'm not sure if I want to see Americans as the Sailor Senshi >..>

Saying that implies that you wouldn't want to see Americans cosplaying as them either? Because saying something like that implies a lot of things. Not picking a fight, just making you aware.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 1:27 am

Yeah, I'm not too crazy about cosplay either to be perfectly honest x3 The only people who should dress up as Sailor Moon characters in my opinions are small children and people selected to act as them.

Not trying to be hating or anything, I just think there should be a screening process when it comes to Sailor Moon. If its not strict enough, people like Asako Uchida get in ._.


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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 6:35 am

I actually will say that I'm in agreement of this. Not per-say Americans (because Americans is a land made up of all types of nationalities or ethnics), but that the actual characters should be at least of Asian backgrounds. I feel if the role was originally intended for a Asian actor then that actor should be Asian.

This was one of my pet peeves when Juon aka The Grudge was brought over here along with other adaptions of the Japanese horror films.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 12:14 pm

@Paprika wrote:
I actually will say that I'm in agreement of this. Not per-say Americans (because Americans is a land made up of all types of nationalities or ethnics), but that the actual characters should be at least of Asian backgrounds. I feel if the role was originally intended for a Asian actor then that actor should be Asian.

This was one of my pet peeves when Juon aka The Grudge was brought over here along with other adaptions of the Japanese horror films.

It depends though. If say, a company was making an American adaptation of the show, then it would be odd to try to place it all in Japan and on Japanese culture. Not everyone knows about Japanese culture. If they were just trying to stay as close to the original as possible, then yes, keep the Japan setting and have Japanese actors/actresses as the characters.

I used to think that way too, but I find it kind of close minded now that you can't take something and adapt it for a different culture. Sailor Moon is the type of show that it could be adapted to another culture and you can still retain the same qualities that attract people to it. The reason its so popular worldwide of because of that. I know the American Dub gets a lot of flack, its not my favorite too, but they did a good job making me originally think it was something happening in an English speaking country (in my mind specifically the US). They (as in the Dic dub) even at least tried to keep the original girls names similar to the Japanese or have some meaning towards which senshi they were, like Lita. But we're talking about if it were to be made into a movie in the States via a hollywood type company and the fact is, if it were to be done over here, it will be adapted and things will be changed to reflect our culture. As long as it wouldn't be to overly screwed up, it would still feel like Sailor Moon. The problem with keeping it all Japanese then having it for a general American audience (not a specific group of fans), is that some of the cultural differences and jokes will not be understood right away. The only reason, we as Sailor Moon fans, know these things is because we've watched it and took time to learn. A mom taking her child to see it will not, nor will the kid. Someone just seeing it for the first time may not think or want to do research on the jokes, unless they are explained.

And some things that are redone for an American audience work. The Office is a great example of that.

But at this point I'm just going to have to agree to disagree with you guys. This is supposed to be discussion on how it may be done or what would happen if it were done over here. Not a debate on why it shouldn't be. We can always start another debate topic on the reasons why Sailor Moon shouldn't be adapted to other cultures.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 12:24 pm

Yeah, Sailor Moon seems like a series that could be adapted to fit into several different cultures. All in all, it seems to be a super hero's coming of age story set within a complex plot line that spans several time periods (and planets). Many of the qualities of the show we have come to love are not culture-specific and many of the qualities are relatable, even if they are culture-specific. The main storyline is not culture specific, especially if you consider the crucial role of the alien civilization of the Silver Millennium. Sure, there are cultural elements because... well, it was created by someone who lives in Japan and was obviously influenced by the day-to-day activities of her culture.

I do not think that the ethnicity of an actor or actress has much of anything to do with his or her acting skills or influence his or her credible portrayal of a character.


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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 1:04 pm

@Brit-chan wrote:
@Paprika wrote:
I actually will say that I'm in agreement of this. Not per-say Americans (because Americans is a land made up of all types of nationalities or ethnics), but that the actual characters should be at least of Asian backgrounds. I feel if the role was originally intended for a Asian actor then that actor should be Asian.

This was one of my pet peeves when Juon aka The Grudge was brought over here along with other adaptions of the Japanese horror films.

It depends though. If say, a company was making an American adaptation of the show, then it would be odd to try to place it all in Japan and on Japanese culture. Not everyone knows about Japanese culture. If they were just trying to stay as close to the original as possible, then yes, keep the Japan setting and have Japanese actors/actresses as the characters.

I used to think that way too, but I find it kind of close minded now that you can't take something and adapt it for a different culture. Sailor Moon is the type of show that it could be adapted to another culture and you can still retain the same qualities that attract people to it. The reason its so popular worldwide of because of that. I know the American Dub gets a lot of flack, its not my favorite too, but they did a good job making me originally think it was something happening in an English speaking country (in my mind specifically the US). They (as in the Dic dub) even at least tried to keep the original girls names similar to the Japanese or have some meaning towards which senshi they were, like Lita. But we're talking about if it were to be made into a movie in the States via a hollywood type company and the fact is, if it were to be done over here, it will be adapted and things will be changed to reflect our culture. As long as it wouldn't be to overly screwed up, it would still feel like Sailor Moon. The problem with keeping it all Japanese then having it for a general American audience (not a specific group of fans), is that some of the cultural differences and jokes will not be understood right away. The only reason, we as Sailor Moon fans, know these things is because we've watched it and took time to learn. A mom taking her child to see it will not, nor will the kid. Someone just seeing it for the first time may not think or want to do research on the jokes, unless they are explained.

And some things that are redone for an American audience work. The Office is a great example of that.

But at this point I'm just going to have to agree to disagree with you guys. This is supposed to be discussion on how it may be done or what would happen if it were done over here. Not a debate on why it shouldn't be. We can always start another debate topic on the reasons why Sailor Moon shouldn't be adapted to other cultures.

Understandable and a vaild point as well ^^ And sorry for the possible start of a debate. ^^

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 7:40 pm

@Brit-chan wrote:
I think in order to do an LA type Hollywood adaption, it would need to have a really decent budget so we could get proper special fx, an animated talking cat that looks realistic (think along the levels of like Gollum from LOTR or Dobby from Harry Potter). Unfortunately, as popular as Sailor Moon is, I don't think there is enough appeal or perhaps fanbase in the US (not yet at least, it seems like its picking up steam) to have a hollywood company want to shell out millions of dollars for a project that might possibly flop like many other kids oriented movies.

Also, I think if made by a US company, it might be weird to try to set it in Japan. I think it'd be more interesting if they adapted to a more worldly view. It would have to take place in a big city like Tokyo, but maybe all the girls come from different ethnic background?

Sometimes I think it might work better as a Mini-Series like the Dune series got. There is just so much to condense into a movie. Even if trying to condense one season into one movie, i'd hate for it to have too fast of a pacing, kind of like how the beginning of hte manga feels at times, but not as slow of a pacing as the anime series. It might not even be horri-bad if it was a Scy-Fy production. Their production of the Dune series was actually well done. I also enjoyed Tin Man, which was a Scy-Fy production too. A mini-series could work out great too because it could be like 3 or 4 hour long episodes of each arc. So 3-4 Episodes Dark Kingdom, Black Moon, Infinity, Dream, Stars. I think they could also choose to follow the manga a little more closely for pacing and story telling, but maybe leave in elements of the anime too.

You've touched upon many good points.

Obviously the budget would have to be accommodating.

Animated cats would be wonderful. As the artists behind the Twilight wolves have proved, animated creatures can look incredibly realistic.

You mentioned kids movies... I would hate for a SM to be made with a younger audience in mind. To be honest, if you make something look cool enough in the most badass fun way possible, kids will want to see it. I just wouldn't want a bunch of blatantly compulsory jokes just to get laughs from the kids (think Star Wars Episode I... dear God)

I also agree that a globalized effort would be most realistic. Though the film was terrible, I liked how Dragonball had Asian, American and Asian-American actors. I think it would work well for SM if the actress of Mars was asian due to her traditionally Japanese qualities. Or perhaps Mercury due to her petite frame and studious work ethic.

Oh, and I'd also love to see a naturally blonde Usagi/Serena (I say Serena because it might be a better option for a more broad audience...) or at least one that doesn't look terrible with a wig.

I know that a lot of fans will disagree with me but I think movie-pacing could work out. BUT, we'd have to be open about the studio's interpretation. For lack of a more original example, think of the Superman movies: there have been three franchise attempts (Donner's films from the 70s & 80s, Bryan Singer's 2006 film, the 2013 film in production right now). The filmmakers have had over 50 years of material to pull from but they always chose key elements, gave subtle homage and then put their own spin on it. This approach has proved very successful. I wouldn't mind it.

And just a random note... I didn't enjoy Tin Man just because the writers tried far too hard to tie everything in (I cringed when the 8-year old Dorothy pronounced "Tutor" as "Toto").

And while a mini-series would be great to avoid filler... it is TV and TV is notorious for terrible budget.

@Paprika wrote:
I feel if the role was originally intended for a Asian actor then that actor should be Asian.

Well... about that... yes, Sailor Moon takes place in Japan but how many typical 2nd year middle schoolers have blonde hair in Japan? Going by aesthetics (and since this is a visual method of storytelling we're discussing), appearance matters a lot.

Unless they take the PGSM route with magical hair colors, lol.

Or HELL, what if they cast separate actresses to play the senshi and civilian characters?

^They would never do that; it's too expensive. But it's fun to think about.

Okay, that's all from me for now.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 7:49 pm

You can do so much with animation nowadays that I bet some pretty cool attack and transformation sequences could be created. I loved the animatronic cat they used in Sabrina (Salem still cracks me up) and I think that could work out pretty well for Luna and Artemis.

I would much prefer that they did not go the magical hair colors route. Of course, blue hair is unnatural, but it shouldn't be too hard to find a blue hair dye that isn't neon.

I wonder what the movie would be about? Maybe a re-telling of the first season of Sailor Moon... or a whole new storyline?

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 8:23 pm

@Sailor Venus wrote:
You can do so much with animation nowadays that I bet some pretty cool attack and transformation sequences could be created. I loved the animatronic cat they used in Sabrina (Salem still cracks me up) and I think that could work out pretty well for Luna and Artemis.

I would much prefer that they did not go the magical hair colors route. Of course, blue hair is unnatural, but it shouldn't be too hard to find a blue hair dye that isn't neon.

I wonder what the movie would be about? Maybe a re-telling of the first season of Sailor Moon... or a whole new storyline?

GAH! As an aspiring cinematographer, I would personally LOVE to choreograph the camera movements for a transformation sequence. I would try to be faithful to the anime.. just because they're so.freaking.badass.

I wasn't going to mention Salem but I'm secretly glad you did. I LOVE that show. I had a YouTube marathon of it last year. I guess animatronic would also work--it'd be slightly off but the studio could save a lot of money.

I love how my tenses switch so its like this thing is actually happening. I get excited entirely too easily.

And I think going with the first arc is pretty classic--just like Lex Luthor is the main villain for Superman and Joker for Batman. Whenever I think of SM, I think of classic Sailor Moon. Though, that could be attributed to me growing up with classic Sailor Moon (I watched it when it first came out... yeah, I was four but it still counts!) But also, the other arcs are somewhat messy when you think about them. They seem to be rehashings by the time you get to SuperS.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime19th October 2011, 9:21 pm

I completely forgot about Salem! But it seems animatronic animals aren't really used much anymore. Its all CG or a mixture of live action and CG.

Your point on kids movies, the only reason I think it would be geared towards kids is because Sailor Moon (the anime) was originally (and still sorta is) geared at girls age like 8-14 or so. I think though it could be more on the maturity level of a recent comic book super hero movie and it would be fine. I personally would love it to be more mature like the manga. A SM movie with a PG-13 rating would be totally fine by me.

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PostSubject: Re: The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon   The concept of a live-action Sailor Moon I_icon_minitime20th October 2011, 7:16 am

@Reiko wrote:
Well... about that... yes, Sailor Moon takes place in Japan but how many typical 2nd year middle schoolers have blonde hair in Japan? Going by aesthetics (and since this is a visual method of storytelling we're discussing), appearance matters a lot.

Unless they take the PGSM route with magical hair colors, lol.

Or HELL, what if they cast separate actresses to play the senshi and civilian characters?

^They would never do that; it's too expensive. But it's fun to think about.

Okay, that's all from me for now.

Honestly, as I read through other posts regarding my comment, it does make more sense to have a mixed cast as others have pointed out that Sailor Moon could easily be translated into multiple cultures regardless of where its point of orgin came from. I guess for me, since I have seen too many stories adapted to our culture hacked and slashed, it probably turned me off of it (probably something I really need to get over because I do not like being narrow minded nor having people see me as narrow minded). If a multi-cultural cast was put together and done right, it very well could be a great sucess.

Anyways, that's all I have for that. And I really do apologize if anyone took my comment the wrong way. ^^;

@Reiko wrote:
And while a mini-series would be great to avoid filler... it is TV and TV is notorious for terrible budget.

Maybe instead of a mini-series, maybe a movie triology/series? Something like they did with Lord of the Rings or Harry Potter since they had huge budgets? If it's a triology, this could show the 3 arcs that had the largest impact on the Sailor Moon series or if its a series, each arc could be turned into a movie.

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