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 English Sub variations?

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Reiko
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PostSubject: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 2:54 pm

One thing that stumps me is knowing which subs are the original. I feel like some I've seen online might be fan subs.

Sometimes, the english subs are in yellow text. Other times they are color-coded according to speaker--the text is white but outlined in a secondary color indicative of the character. Example, Usagi's words are in white and pink, Minako's words are in white and orange etc

Are they the same subs for each version? Are there different companies doing different subs? Is one a "bootleg" effort or a fansub?

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 5:38 pm

Usually with official subs, it is one colored text. Companies don't take the time like fansubbers do to make nice color coded text.

I think most of official Sailor Moon subs have either the yellow or white text.

If you are seeing the color coded text, it is 99% likely that its a fansub. I've yet to see an official sub of any anime with that. Smile

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 7:52 pm

Thanks for the confirmation. Though, from your experience (or anyone who's well versed in Japanese-->English translations), are the subs the same? Or are there weird disconnects like with the original to dub?

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 7:59 pm

Hm, i haven't really compared an official sub to a fansub before, but i think just due to translator differences, i would think that there will be differences. What tends to happen more often in fansubs, is that they will explain japanese jokes or cultural references in little notes that the official dub will take no time to do.

I've seen things like in official subs "ittaidakimasu" = "It's time to eat!" or something along the lines. In a fansub, they'll just leave the "ittaidakimasu" in romanji and explain its maening.

However, i think in general, both official and fan subs try to get the general meaning of the dialogue across. Japanese can often be difficult to translate into english. especially when there are no english words for japanese words and vice versa.

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 8:18 pm

In my experience, fansubs are better than official subs. As Brit-chan said, fan-subbers take more time in explaining inside jokes, Japanese puns and cultural references. As fans, they seem to care more about what they are translating and I usually like their work a lot better.

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 8:32 pm

Yeah, i agree. I think its mostly due to the fact that they have the time and want to give the effort into putting forth good subs. I think with official subs its more like "ok, we spent all this time and money on the dub. Subs? Oh that's easy. Just slap some text on there."

Honestly I'm the asshole that wonders why they bother dubbing things. It would just be cheaper to release subbed only discs. But thats me. ^^

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 9:27 pm

@Brit-chan wrote:
Yeah, i agree. I think its mostly due to the fact that they have the time and want to give the effort into putting forth good subs. I think with official subs its more like "ok, we spent all this time and money on the dub. Subs? Oh that's easy. Just slap some text on there."

Honestly I'm the asshole that wonders why they bother dubbing things. It would just be cheaper to release subbed only discs. But thats me. ^^

AND ME TOO. although the world would be a very sad and desolate place if we had never been able to hear david lucas or chris sabat's voices.

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 9:28 pm

Lol, I can think of a reason: I was barely four when I started watching Sailor Moon. I don't think I could keep up if I had to read all the time!!

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 9:52 pm

Haha, I know. Actually i've read/seen interviews with animation directors, like Hayao Miyazaki, stating they would rather it be dubbed in a foreign country's language so that way people could enjoy the animation and not be bothered with the reading. Plus its not like I hate all dubs either. ^_^

I've also just gotten really good at read the subs now so I basically just have to glance to see what they are saying and can still pay attention to the animation.

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 11:44 pm

I don't think one style of translating is necessarily superior over the other. One can take context into consideration and maybe translate "Itadakimasu" as "Time to eat!" in one case and "Well, I guess I'll try some, then!" in another.

Or take another word that we hear a lot in this series: "Odango." Literally, it refers to those little round treats made from rice flower.

Those treats can indeed be translated as "dumplings," but the word "dumpling" can refer to so many different foods--see the Wikipedia entry for dumpling. "Odango" itself is technically the most accurate of all, but "odango head" is probably going to confuse a lot of people.

I personally think the best way to go about explaining different aspects of Japanese culture is either to slip the meaning into the line, or to include explanations in some "Bonus Features." If the explanation takes more than a few words, I don't think side notes are a good idea. I've seen fansubs that have side notes that take a good 10-20 seconds to read, which is too long for the viewer to keep up with the action.

And I do think dubbing is important. Some people have disabilities that make it difficult to read subtitles, or are simply more aurally than visually inclined.
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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime18th July 2011, 11:50 pm

@Rachael wrote:
I personally think the best way to go about explaining different aspects of Japanese culture is either to slip the meaning into the line, or to include explanations in some "Bonus Features." If the explanation takes more than a few words, I don't think side notes are a good idea. I've seen fansubs that have side notes that take a good 10-20 seconds to read, which is too long for the viewer to keep up with the action.

I agree with that. I hate having to pause and read what they put a note. I've seen some fansubs where they put the notes either at the beginning or the end of the episode, which was really helpful too. Sometimes the notes are very short or something.

I'm not saying its wrong to translate itaidakimasu into an equivalent english translation, I'm just giving an example between the difference of what is usually done in fansubs vs official subs.

Quote :
And I do think dubbing is important. Some people have disabilities that
make it difficult to read subtitles, or are simply more aurally than
visually inclined.

I agree with this too. Like I said, I'm just an a-hole. XD

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime20th July 2011, 7:52 am

Not to derail the thread, but everyone's notes above is why I usually include translators notes for video files as a separate video that people may -chose- to watch, but they aren't forced to read notes during the episode itself ^^;

Not sure why official companies don't do this, though. =\

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime20th July 2011, 4:22 pm

@Brit-chan wrote:
I agree with that. I hate having to pause and read what they put a note. I've seen some fansubs where they put the notes either at the beginning or the end of the episode, which was really helpful too. Sometimes the notes are very short or something.

That works, too!

My Rurouni Kenshin DVDs were released by Media Blasters, and they included notes as bonus features--or maybe they had their own category. But anyway, they were really helpful. I'd never heard the "-dono" honorific or knew about the pronoun "ore" until I read them. There's a lot I learned just from reading those notes.
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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime21st July 2011, 4:57 pm

For me, anesthetics is the big thing. That blurry yellow text is kinda ugly in comparison to the beautiful color-coded text fansubbers use.

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime28th July 2011, 12:42 am

I agree too cosmos. Sometimes the text fansubbers use can be hard to read, but i really like how they'll change the color per character. Especially if the character is talking off screen.

@Rachael - I totally forgot about that!! I have one Rurouni Kenshin dvd and i remember that being pretty nifty. ^_^

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime28th July 2011, 2:18 am

@Brit-chan wrote:
I agree too cosmos. Sometimes the text fansubbers use can be hard to read, but i really like how they'll change the color per character. Especially if the character is talking off screen.

This. I may sound horrible for saying this but sometimes it can be really hard for me to tell who's speaking while watching the original/Japanese version. Japanese women in general can speak with really high pitched voices and when they yell, a lot of their respective tone is lost. For example, the VAs for Usagi and Minako sound similar to me while the VAs for Makoto and Rei can sound similar at times. Basically, the color coding helps a bunch if the character isn't shown speaking.

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime28th July 2011, 9:19 am

That makes sense though. Especially if you aren't used to hearing Japanese speaking. I've listened to it for a long time, so I can tell the difference between voices and such, but at the beginning when i first started watching subs, it was a bit challenging.

And small confession that I should add to the SM confession thread: the first time I heard Usagi's japanese voice was in the sub R movie that I had bought on VHS...and I kinda laughed. It was so high pitched! I wasn't expecting it at all. XD

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime28th July 2011, 5:57 pm

@Brit-chan wrote:
And small confession that I should add to the SM confession thread: the first time I heard Usagi's japanese voice was in the sub R movie that I had bought on VHS...and I kinda laughed. It was so high pitched! I wasn't expecting it at all. XD

Lol, that's a more surprisingly and legitimate confession than your last one Wink

Ditto though. My face was something close to this ----> (O_o) when I first heard Usagi in the sub. I was also grateful to hear Luna didn't sound like an uptight nanny and instead sounded closer to Usagi in age.

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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime30th July 2013, 4:39 am

I do prefer fansubs for most of the reasons listed above... When I started watching Classic two years ago, I was watching the Sailor Moon Center fansub, and it was awesome. I finished that season and R with the ADV sub, and now I'm watching the Pioneer sub for S, and it's... Less-than-stellar, to be honest. I really dislike how they, well, Americanize the subs. ADV had an annoying tendency of translating "Mamo-chan" as "Mamo", and they also continuously mistranslated "onee-chan/sama" as the character's name, which was stupid when you can literally hear that they're not saying the character's name. -_-;;;; Also, it suprised me when I got to S that the attack Sailor Moon used was actually called "Moon Princess Halation", as ADV translated it as "Moon Princess Elimination". (I'm not sure why I didn't notice it was mistranslated before... I guess I just wasn't paying enough attention.)
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PostSubject: Re: English Sub variations?   English Sub variations? I_icon_minitime30th July 2013, 10:45 am

I wouldn't say that translated "onee-chan" as the characters name a mistranslation, but just a decision in the localization of the translation. Many translaters will translate those words of endearment as the characters name since we don't exactly have a fitting equivalent in English. That doesn't necessarily mean its wrong. Just a preference of the translator.

Now other things such as attack names...thats probably to maybe not confuse the English audience from the American dub since the dub had changed many of the attack names?  But its possible it could have just been a mistake too. :/

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