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 PGSM's one problem/flaw?

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Sailor Neptune
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PostSubject: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 23, 2013 5:31 am

SPOILER FOR THE ENDING/FINALE:
Continue to read at your own risk.

I really love PGSM. I didn't expect to fall in love with it that much, I actually started watching it for reasons unknown to myself except perhaps mild curiosity about this cheese fest of which I've seen a couple glimpses of in Tumblr. What I didn't expect was to fall in love so completely and hopelessly with each and everyone of the girls. With ALL the characters, actually.

But one thing that does bother me is the way they handled the whole Princess storyline. How Usagi destroyed the moon kingdom (AND EARTH) the first time around. How she did it again despite her promises and best intentions. It just... left a bad taste in an otherwise flawless and wonderfully developed story.

Does it bother anyone else? The core of Sailor Moon is supposed to be about how she's the savior, and I find it interesting that they've turned that on its head with PGSM. I know that Sailor Moon repeated her past mistake/selfishness in the manga too by repeating her suicide over Endymion, but at least she didn't take the entire world with her. They really twisted this to the absolute extreme. For example, Mamoru and Usagi's love in the manga after the first arc is seen as strength and his presence is what always gave her the courage to save the world. Here, that very same love destroys everything.

I wish they at least made things end up differently in present day, proving that Usagi is NOT Serenity (Or at least that she's strong enough to defeat her past self). It just made her like the ultimate villain/bad guy and I still can't wrap my head around that.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 23, 2013 5:47 am

Be warned!! Lots of spoilers and ranting in this post!

I kind of agree. PGSM's ending is unsatisfying :/ I loved the Princess/Usagi divide, and how the Princess of the past destroyed the world. I think it was a great and more dramatic way to sort of do a nod towards the manga-suicide plot line. I loved that they acknowledged that Usagi was not the Princess and the Princess was not Usagi. They might be the same soul but they are not the same person.

I loved seeing Usagi work towards controlling this frightening power that she has, and you can see just how hard she has to try. She really grows as a person through out the whole series, and its quite beautiful. One thing I hated when I first watched was when Ami becomes Darkury, I HATED that Usagi seemed more interested in being with Mamoru during that arc, when her friend is captured and turned evil. And yet, Darkury seemed to almost take a backseat at times when it came to the romance between Usagi and Mamoru.

Made me so angry xD But now I think it kind of shows that Usagi could have been like the Princess. She could be just as single minded about Mamoru as the Princess is about Endymion. That she could forget about everything else, to not care about anything else, just because of Mamoru.

But she seems to push past that, and grows to realize that she has other people in her life that she loves and cares about too. So in that way, she is better and stronger and more mature than the Princess ever was. I like that it takes Usagi some time to grow as a character, and grow past that. She might be the same as the Princess, but she's different too. She's still her own person.

So when the ending happened, and the world ended up destroyed anyway.... Yeah, that makes me angry xD They go through all of this character development, all to kind of just say "Oh well, can't change the past/destiny/etc" when they showed that Usagi was changing herself!!

I have rambled, but yeah, I agree with you xD I wish the ending would have been much different. It was pretty unsatisfying and kind of negated a lot of what I loved about the whole series ;-; And it was kind of confusing too xD

But Minako is back by the very end, so I guess I can't complain too much haha xD

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 02, 2013 3:55 pm

Actually, I need to translate a post I wrote for my website, I talked about the Princess.

I really liked her storyline, because it showed us that ANYONE can be evil, if they set their minds to it.

I mean, IMAGINE IF ENDYMION HAD CHOSEN BERYL! I believe that is what is so magical about PGSM =)

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSat Jan 18, 2014 5:20 pm

I felt PGSM Serenity was true to the selfish b*tch nature. I mean, yeah, did it suck? Of course. Was it ridiculous and irrational? Absolutely. But it showed Serenity and even Usagi as, well, human.

In any story that involves people and relationships (no matter which kind), if there is love, you'll get selfishness and b*tchiness. You'll get destruction, irrationality, ridiculousness (I mean god, if anyone has watched the show Supernatural and watched the stupid things Sam/Dean does...). Because, since we are human, we get caught up in our emotions. Even Usagi, no matter what continuity she's in. Our home, our world, isn't this planet Earth, but rather, the people we love and are with. I mean, you can take anyone, anyone at all, and stick them on like, Mars, and they won't care that they are there just as long as they are surrounded by everyone they love. People can even die and die in peace knowing that on the other side, who they love will be there.

Often times, she is ready to throw away the world if she can't have her friends/Mamoru in it by her side. She doesn't think the world is worth it. Is it selfish? Yeah. But she isn't the only one that's selfish (looking at you Haruka and Michiru).

So, as irritating as it was that Serenity just kills the world twice due to her selfishness, we know she has flaws. We know she is a screwed up Princess and doesn't necessarily care for everyone else. And that's where Usagi's balance comes in.

I mean yeah Usagi will chuck the world in an instant if her friends are gone, but with the right prompting, she won't. And she'll bring everyone back. That doesn't excuse what Serenity does, but hey, we need flaws. We need to see that Serenity isn't a Mary Sue. We need plot, drama, complexes. Otherwise PGSM loses its shine, beauty, rawness, and everything else we love about this continuity.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 19, 2014 2:06 am

I can appreciate that PGSM!Serenity is like that, what I was hoping was for Usagi to prove that she's different because she's Usagi. Because she is a new incarnation and she can't just be taken over by her past self like that. I guess I was hoping she would stop Serenity from destroying the world and overpower her own past self (because wasn't Minako's whole lesson was that her past shouldn't dictate her present? It's what everyone's been saying and what I agree with).

I suppose Usagi kind of did that by bringing everyone back, but it felt a little too late for me. Usagi is selfish at times, but I believe in any continuity, the girl who refused to give up one life to save the world will never, ever sacrifice the entire world because she lost one person.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 19, 2014 2:18 am

Sounds more like something Michiru would do. That whole, "A world without __ isn't worth saving" shtick.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 19, 2014 3:23 am

Regardless, she still did it Razz

Usagi, to me, has always been like that. If she loses her friends or Mamoru, it's game over.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 19, 2014 10:46 am

Nah, she did lose them and went on to fight Beryl/Metallia and then again with Galaxia. But maybe that's why anime!Usagi is my favorite version of her. ^^

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 19, 2014 2:03 pm

And here  I was thinking you were going to talk about how the music isn't quite as timeless of as say Myu music and a couple of the anime songs (though many of the anime's music isn't really timeless either) and more of a product of its time period and not quite as memorable but still not bad either. Cause thats my main flaw. xD  ANYWAY the ending really never bothered me much...

The whole point of Princess Serenity and the way it played out was cause of the main theme of PGSM: going against destiny (which whoa, kinda big thing for an asian culture show).  Even though the world did end up getting destroyed, when Usagi and Mamoru woke up, Usagi immediately realized what she had did and resolved, with their love, they would revive everything and sacrifice themselves to make things right.  Which is why when the world is revived, they aren't there at all and erased from everyone's memory. I dunno, yeah it sucks she destroyed the world again, but also everything worked out in the end? They didn't let destiny get the best of everything and were willing to sacrifice themselves to restore it. 

However, we are rewatching PGSM again for livestream so maybe my opinion will change or I will rethink what i just said here when we get to the finale (which won't be till like....june xD)

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 19, 2014 2:29 pm

@Sailor Mercury wrote:
Nah, she did lose them and went on to fight Beryl/Metallia and then again with Galaxia. But maybe that's why anime!Usagi is my favorite version of her. ^^

Because the senshi always threaten her with a can of whoop chibi if she throws everything away because they're dead.  PGSM's one problem/flaw? 3120693907 

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 20, 2014 1:15 am

LOL, I actually like the PGSM songs just fine. C'est La Vie drove me crazy in the beginning due to its repetitiveness, but now I actually quite like it even if it kind of sounds like a children song >_>

I adore Yakusoku and Friend, and Sakura Fubuki is pretty too ^^ But yeah, I suppose compared to the anime and musical they aren't as awesome.

These probably belong on a different thread now, ssh

I think my opinion will probably change when I rewatch PGSM too. Maybe I'll be more forgiving now that I know what's coming Razz I would like to try getting in on that livestream so we can all cry together enjoy it together.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 20, 2014 2:05 am

I honestly loved how it went about and the ending of it. The story involves a girl that has a past incarnation fighting for control of her body in present day. Her friends are great, but also have their own troubles that she can't heal. Usagi has a love interest that has some horrible destiny that she for some reason can't be with which seems unfair to her since she feels the past shouldn't be controlling the present.

There are all these conflicts going on at the same time for this one girl who is about 16 years old in the series. This is a lot for a young girl to deal with. I felt destroying the world was a very appropriate response in a plot line. The whole series she fights to be with the man she loves and despite her efforts she fails. She breaks. Within that moment the Princess who is a lot more rash, angry, and impulsive comes in and takes over. 

The Silver Crystal is a powerful thing that can be used for a good or evil which is pretty obvious since the Dark Kingdom wants to use it for their own so badly. It's not a force of good. It's a neutral power that is trying to be kept out of the hands of evil. 

The fact that Usagi and Mamoru would allow themselves to die to bring life back to everyone is a completely selfless act. They were finally together, enjoyed some of the time they had, and did what they had to do for everyone else. Luckily for them they got their lives back, aren't troubled by their past anymore by being a Sailor Senshi, and can finally live out their present day lives like normal people.

I just love PGSM so much. cfhmiewhfiwhdmiwh

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 20, 2014 10:41 am

I definitely didn't really "get" the princess storyline when I watched through PGSM a couple of years ago. You're right-- Sailor Moon is a savior figure, not a destroyer. And whenever Usagi was overtaken by her, the fight became so destructive and completely different from what Sailor Moon stived to achieve. With that said, this thread has kind of swayed my opinion, and Lust up there had some great things to say!

But... lets be honest. They made a lot of weird decisions with this show. Sailor Venus segregating herself and then dying of illness? Luna and Artemis being toys? Luna transforming into a child (and now Artemis)? On and on...

I guess we wouldn't love it without all these things though... hehe.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 20, 2014 1:49 pm

Well Sailor Moon might be a savior figure but that doesn't mean Princess Serenity is. Serenity =/= Usagi/Sailor Moon and its made very apparent in PGSM that this is the case. Its only hinted at a little in the anime and manga and the Myus hinted at more but not as much as PGSM. I think part of it needs to come from understanding the concept of reincarnation in Asian culture. Its not that you are the same person reborn over and over but more just your soul (rather than there being an afterlife, the soul continues on forever into a new being each time), which is why its very important to remember Usagi =/= Serenity.

The whole point of Serenity taking over Usagi was to drive more into the fighting against destiny rather than fulfilling your destiny. (plus ALL THE DRAMASSSS)

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 20, 2014 2:59 pm

The best example of what you're saying about reincarnation in Asian culture is comparing Kikyo and Kagome from InuYasha. They were both linked to InuYasha through the Shikon jewel and through Priestess powers, but that was it. They were their own people completely through personality and beliefs.

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PostSubject: Re: PGSM's one problem/flaw?   PGSM's one problem/flaw? I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 20, 2014 4:37 pm

I'm having PGSM feels everywhere >.>

*contribution post*

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